Super Smash Bros. 4/5

So now that new Smash games have been announced for 3DS and WiiU, I figure I'd make this thread for us to get hyped/discuss the possibilities for these new additions into the franchise.

For instance, how will the two versions differ? What's a good character amount for a handheld version? Will there be as massive a story mode?

And what the hell's the name gonna be?!

On the old forum, I originally voted for 3DS, but recently I've changed my opinion.

Yea I recently decided that it will be best on WiiU. We got the WiiU gamepad to use. For 3DS....aw geez.....the controls will be just...awful.

TERRIBLE. Not to mention multiplayer.

Yea! I heard there's going to be no multiplayer. It's possibly going to be gimmicky as hell cause it's on 3DS, which is already a gimmick lol.

Yeah it's probably going to be crap.
And I'm probably still going to buy it ahahaha.

Vyzor wrote:Yea! I heard there's going to be no multiplayer. It's possibly going to be gimmicky as hell cause it's on 3DS, which is already a gimmick lol.

NONE? AT ALL? You must be joking. That makes no sense. Who the hell gets a fighting game just to fight nothing but bots?

I recall that's what I keep hearing. It better have multiplayer.

So who's gonna be in the roster?
Back in Olde Country, we had an early thread about this. I designeda possibe roster.

I, in the old forum, wrote:There were 12 characters in SSB64, 25 in Melee, and 35 in Brawl. I think a roster of 50 characters is reasonable.

Now, let's look at this by franchise. Each franchise will have one column, although smaller franchises will be grouped together.

Mario
Mario.
Luigi.
Peach.
Bowser.
Add Bowser Jr. He has loads of moveset potential, and it adds a villain to the roster.

Mario spin-off.
DK.
Diddy.
Add K. Rool. His moveset can be partially inspired by DKC 2+3 if you want.
Yoshi.
Wario.

Zelda
Link.
Zelda/Shiek.
Ganondorf.
Replace Toon Link with Midna. She's a floating imp, so her aerials and movement can stay like TL's. Just change the specials to fit her character.
Add another villain. Vaati or Skull Kid or Zant or whoever, doesn't really matter to me.

Metroid and F-Zero
Samus.
Add Ridley.
Add Dark Samus.
Captain Falcon.
Add Samurai Goroh?

Kirby and cartoony
Kirby.
Meta Knight.
King Dedede.
Olimar.
Add Starfy.

Star Fox and futuristic
Fox.
Falco.
Wolf.
Add Krystal.
Add the guy from Sin and Punishment.

Pokemon
Pikachu.
Jigglypuff.
Pokemon Trainer.
Add Mewtwo.
Replace Lucario with a 5th gen Pokemon. Maybe Zoroark. Taking out Lucario is the only way to add Mewtwo and still have room to represent the fresh gen of Pokemon.

Fire Emblem and Earthbound
Marth.
Ike.
Add a new FE character. Maybe Lynn or Roy.
Ness.
Lucas.

Other franchises
Pit.
Add Custom Robo?
Add Tom Nook?
Add Little Mac.
Add Mii?

Retro and 3rd party
Sonic.
Take out Snake and add Megaman.
Ice Climbers.
R.O.B.
Mr. Game and Watch.

The ones with a question mark are questionable. I was sort of scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Now, I'm still cool with this choice of mine, but before I rediscovered this post, I had been thinking up a new roster. One with slight differences.

So in Brawl the characters (once all unlocked) were arranged into thematic columns.
Mario.
Mario spin-off.
Zelda.
Retro.
Kirby/cartoony.
Star Fox/F-Zero.
Pokemon.
Fire Emblem/Mother.
3rd Party/Game and Watch.
In my old roster, I made 10 columns of 5, but now, I'm thinking of just taking Brawl's organization and adding (on average) two characters per column. One immediate difference this creates with my old roster is that the major franchises (Mario, Zelda, Pokemon) get more characters.
All right, let's go.

Mario
Mario.
Luigi.
Peach.
Bowser.
Add Bowser Jr.
Add RPG character.
This one's pretty straightforward. Bowser Jr. has been a popular request ever since Brawl was announced. And the RPGs have an abundance of popular characters to choose from (Geno, Fawful,etc.).

Mario spin-off.
DK.
Diddy.
Yoshi.
Wario.
Add K. Rool.
Add WarioWare/Yoshi character.
K. Rool is another popular choice, and the sixth character is simply meant to round out the column.

Zelda
Link.
Zelda/Shiek.
Ganondorf.
Replace Toon Link with Midna.
Add villain.
Add villain.
Toon Link is fun to play in Brawl, but the concept of him, on paper, is unnecessary. "Okay, so he's Link, but from another game. OHOOHOHOHOHO." No. Midna should be of suitable size to replace Toon-Link's physical gameplay.

Then there's the villains. Oh boy. Zelda villains probably outshine their heroes more than any other Nintendo franchise. There's so many to choose from: Skull Kid, Aghanim, Zant, Ghirahim. We have our options.

Retro
Samus.
Ice Climbers.
Pit.
R.O.B.
Mr. Game and Watch.
Add Dark Samus.
Here is the second big change from my old roster; Metroid/F-Zero and Retro/3rd party have been bombarded together, pulling out F-Zero and 3rd party (I will get to them later), and leaving just Retro.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but we shouldn't have Ridley as a playable character. The argument has gone on for so long that it almost isn't worth it anymore. We have Boss Battles now, so Ridley can stay his old big self. Aside from that, Metroid really isn't that big of a franchise. Big enough for two, but not for three.

Kirby/Other
Kirby.
Meta Knight.
King Dedede.
Olimar.
Add _____.
Add _____.
Whoever does not make it into the last column can go here.

Star Fox/F-Zero
Fox.
Falco.
Wolf.
Captain Falcon.
Add Krystal.
Add Samurai Gordo/Black ShadowF-Zero has omved in my roster from Metroid/Retro back to its place in Brawl. Both new additions are popular choices, although I am questioning the idea of having four Star Fox characters.

Pokemon
Pikachu.
Jigglypuff.
Change Pokemon Trainer's pokemon.
Add Mewtwo.
Replace Lucario with Zoroark.
Add another Pokemon Trainer with different pokemon.
The thing about pokemon is that, it doesn't have a clear mascot. Okay, there's Pikachu, but it doesn't have much of an impact on the Pokemon world in the actual games. It's just another Pokemon.

The beauty of Pokemon is that there is so many charaters to play with. Final Fantasy VI has 14 playable characters. Pokemon has 649. And you can have multiples of each. Which is why I added another Pokemon Trainer, and suggested changing the original Trainer' pokemon. Trainers are supposed to have one starter. So, keep the Charizard (it makes sense to make the pokemon that's been with them the longest the strongest), and pick different pokemon for the small water-type and the medium grass-type.

Now, there is two groups of pokemon that do hold some sort of iconicity in the games; starters (which are covered with Pokemon Trainers1 and 2) and legendaries. Ever since Ruby and Sapphire, legendaries have driven the plot. A single one of these creatures has a huge effect on the evironment around them. This makes it all the more important to bring back Mewtwo. It's just not for the sake of bringing it back; it represents the rare class of pokemon that actually hold some individual value.

Fire Emblem and Earthbound
Marth.
Ike.
Ness.
Lucas.
Add a new FE character.
Add a new Mother character.
These guys just might be more well-known here than from their actual games. This column is simple, add a new character for each franchise.

3rd party/Other Nintendo
Sonic.
Take out Snake and add _____
Add _____.
Add _____.
Add _____.
Add _____.
I'd be fine with any ratio of 3rd party:Other here. There's plenty of choices for either: Simon Belmont, MegaMan, Starfy, Little Mac, Tom Nookm Custom Robo, etc. As for Snake; if we don't take him out, cool, whatever doesn't really irk me that much. But he's not very necessary.

Any questions?

Hmmm....Brawl added 17 new characters (including all PT's Pokemon) and Melee added 14 (including Sheik), while SSB had 12 to start with.

SSB = +2 to Melee
SSBM = +3 to Brawl
SSBB = +4 to WiiU?

So WiiU Smash will have 21 new characters?

Good theory?

Vyzor wrote:Hmmm....Brawl added 17 new characters (including all PT's Pokemon) and Melee added 14 (including Sheik), while SSB had 12 to start with.

SSB = +2 to Melee
SSBM = +3 to Brawl
SSBB = +4 to WiiU?

So WiiU Smash will have 21 new characters?

Good theory?

There wasn't 43 characters in Brawl. There were 35, 39 if you count alternate characters. The only reason Brawl added 17 characters is because it also removed 5 characters from Melee. Oh, and about the 17, I'm assuming you don't count Toon Link?

Oh, and Tyler I agree almost completely with your updated roster.

As for a Mario RPG character, although everyone would like Geno, it seems to be not possible. Geno is actually owned by Square-Enix. Super Mario RPG was made by Squaresoft at the time so he's one of the characters they own. He would count as a 3rd party character just being in the game. Even though I like Geno, It would be more suitable to have a Paper Mario or Mario&Luigi character, such as, Fawful.

I would JIZZ if they added Midna as a character. It could work, Twilight Princess was not the most recent Zelda, but it was still on Wii, and for the next Smash Bros. they'll be looking at all the Wii games. She's also a very wanted character by most.

As for Dark Samus, I think that would be lame. You think that Toon link was just Link OHOHOHOOHO (which I agree) but Dark Samus would just be Samus OHOHOOHOH. But I suppose Dark Samus would have a significantly different moveset than Samus would. In that case, I would be ok with it, but I have a feeling she'd end up a clone.

I agree with adding Krystal, and to have it so there aren't 4 Star Fox characters, just exclude Wolf. I really liked Wolf, but he was way too similar to Fox and Falco, who were already similar. Krystal could use her staff from SFA and have a completely original move set, NOT based off of Fox. But it is nice having an awesome Star Fox villain like Wolf. We'll see what happens.

I don't like Pokemon Trainer, but I wouldn't mind if he was brought back with 5th gen starters as his Pokemon. I still wouldn't like him though.

New FE = Lyn
New MOTHER = Kumatora or Duster

For 3rd party characters, I would rather there be none, but if there WAS it would be a Tales Of character. That is what Namco Bandai has said. They mentioned they wouldn't mind Lloyd Irving. He is pretty awesome! But they said they're not sure if they are going to include 3rd party characters. Also, no Sonic. He already got anally raped from Brawl. Fuck Sonic. He was not fun to use in Brawl and "SONICS THE NAME SPEEDS MY GAME. YOURE TOO SLOW. COME ON STEP IT UP." They wrecked what little hope he had left.

Fuck sakes, I just wrote a solid paragraph. Didn't go through some how. Sure as fuck not writing it again.

Mogotoo wrote:

Vyzor wrote:Hmmm....Brawl added 17 new characters (including all PT's Pokemon) and Melee added 14 (including Sheik), while SSB had 12 to start with.

SSB = +2 to Melee
SSBM = +3 to Brawl
SSBB = +4 to WiiU?

So WiiU Smash will have 21 new characters?

Good theory?

There wasn't 43 characters in Brawl. There were 35, 39 if you count alternate characters. The only reason Brawl added 17 characters is because it also removed 5 characters from Melee. Oh, and about the 17, I'm assuming you don't count Toon Link?

I didn't say Brawl had 43 characters. The new Smash Bros. is EASILY going to remove some old characters. No, I counted Toon Link.

Diddy
Wario
Toon Link
Pit
R.O.B
Meta Knight
King Dedede
Olimar
Wolf
Charizard
Ivysaur
Squirtle
Lucario
Ike
Lucas
Snake
Sonic

Kason Birdman wrote:Fuck sakes, I just wrote a solid paragraph. Didn't go through some how. Sure as fuck not writing it again.

Aw, what was it about?

Vyzor wrote:

Mogotoo wrote:

Vyzor wrote:Hmmm....Brawl added 17 new characters (including all PT's Pokemon) and Melee added 14 (including Sheik), while SSB had 12 to start with.

SSB = +2 to Melee
SSBM = +3 to Brawl
SSBB = +4 to WiiU?

So WiiU Smash will have 21 new characters?

Good theory?

There wasn't 43 characters in Brawl. There were 35, 39 if you count alternate characters. The only reason Brawl added 17 characters is because it also removed 5 characters from Melee. Oh, and about the 17, I'm assuming you don't count Toon Link?

I didn't say Brawl had 43 characters. The new Smash Bros. is EASILY going to remove some old characters. No, I counted Toon Link.

Diddy
Wario
Toon Link
Pit
R.O.B
Meta Knight
King Dedede
Olimar
Wolf
Charizard
Ivysaur
Squirtle
Lucario
Ike
Lucas
Snake
Sonic

Ah, you didn't count Zero Suit Samus. Wait, so who is SSB4 gonna remove?

AHHH right, I completely forgot to count ZSS. Well, my theory is wrong lol. It wouldn't have been right anyways

Vyzor wrote:As for Dark Samus, I think that would be lame. You think that Toon link was just Link OHOHOHOOHO (which I agree) but Dark Samus would just be Samus OHOHOOHOH. But I suppose Dark Samus would have a significantly different moveset than Samus would. In that case, I would be ok with it, but I have a feeling she'd end up a clone.

True, Nintendo could just go and turn her into a clone. Which would be dumb. But then again...Ganondorf.

Vyzor wrote:I agree with adding Krystal, and to have it so there aren't 4 Star Fox characters, just exclude Wolf. I really liked Wolf, but he was way too similar to Fox and Falco, who were already similar. Krystal could use her staff from SFA and have a completely original move set, NOT based off of Fox. But it is nice having an awesome Star Fox villain like Wolf. We'll see what happens.

If Wolf does go, someone needs to fill the gap in that column. Preferably a futuristic character. Sin-and-Punishment guy, perhaps.

Vyzor wrote:Also, no Sonic. He already got anally raped from Brawl. Fuck Sonic. He was not fun to use in Brawl and "SONICS THE NAME SPEEDS MY GAME. YOURE TOO SLOW. COME ON STEP IT UP." They wrecked what little hope he had left.

Sure.

Just crap about new characters and my opinions. Review both your theories also.

Are you guys going to look at the new unlockable characters when they're revealed?

Kason Birdman wrote:Just crap about new characters and my opinions. Review both your theories also.

Are you guys going to look at the new unlockable characters when they're revealed?

Nnnnnngghhh (the sound made when faced with a tough choice). I shouldn't. I looked at the Brawl ones because, hey, it's not like I'm ever going to be able to get a Wii. Which I totally did. I should never dismiss the possibility of getting a WiiU, which means I should never dismiss the possibility of getting Super Smash Bros. Fray.

Then again, my efforts maybe be for naught, since random small talk about it on the Internet might spoil anyway. The identities of unlockable characters aren't as sacred as plot elements in a story.

but that would be pretty sick to unlock a char you had no idea about

Yeah it would be SO awesome, and imagine if you didn't even know the character, so deass.

rob, have a mac melee tourney and get someone to get me to mac/. yee yee

Yeah I'm totally down for that! I'll probably have one in like a month lol, I've met like 4 players so far, not to mention the 3 that live in hamilton.

4 melee players> wujuuuut